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[Ep. 6 - Confederate Iron] The 1905 Naval Review
2016-07-07, 05:11 AM (This post was last modified: 2016-10-02 04:33 PM by carmenara.)
Post: #1
Heart [Ep. 6 - Confederate Iron] The 1905 Naval Review
MODS REQUIRED FOR LATEST BLUEPRINTS
After Cataclysm v1.1.0 for machine guns and decorative parts.
Deco+ 0.03 for big pollution!

Optional:
Grand Alchemist Dahak's APS Adjustment 0.3 or later increases APS gunnery model with realistic features and 10km range.
Simple Weapons Rebalance 1.2 Z1 for improved simple weapons allowing Age of Sail and Ironclad era battles.

Shipbuilders' Guidelines V1.0 of 26 August 1905.
Airship Builder's Guidelines by Luftmarschall Zuthal of the German Imperial Field Airship Fleet


2 October 1905
Who ever thought abusing the dame was a good idea...?
An Open Letter


22 September 1905





The International Fleet's counter-insurgency Task Force 150 engaged Indian militant forces today, driving them back to their offshore base of operations with a decisive naval engagement involving battleships, cruisers and torpedo boats from the British Royal Navy, French Navy, Russian Imperial Navy and Commonwealth naval forces from Australia.

Follow on air raids against the insurgents' offshore base are being launched to keep the Indian rebel forces in disarray. Lloyds of London has classified the Indian Ocean a high threat zone following the loss of several tea clippers and at least one large merchant cruiser to insurgent torpedo rams and fast boats.

The Admiralty at this time has no comment with regards to relations with the new Hindustan Republic government, which to date has been recognized only by Imperial China.

27 August 1915

Cruiser Carnival! The Admiralty desires an increased presence in commerce protection while investing in fast scouting units in the form of torpedo boat destroyers and protected light cruisers.

Designs up to 1915 are accepted, so WW1 cruisers do make the grade.
Is this in response to preliminary reports of an uprising in India - permutated by sightings of a strange rebel faction with mythical, colorful pyramid ships? Find out more in today's copy of Star of Sevastopol...

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24 August 1915 - Custom Campaign for Black Sea Theatre of Operations, planning phase begins. 

20 August -
1915 - THE WINGS OF YESTERDAY
Blueprints of beautiful planes and airships galore!





The Dame-Admiral concludes her diplomatic posting in the EMPIRE OF CORONA. En route, the diplomatic cruiser ACR Yekaterina Velikaya encounters an intercepting force of rebel Zeppelins and aircraft. The Eastern Isles escort frigate DL-24 Sparrow attempts to offer defensive screening while awaiting the FRENCH NAVAL AIR FLEET to save the day!

On the side of anti-Imperialist rebels, the Bolshevik faction of Russia has fielded non-treaty regulation airships to give then an edge against Loyalist forces.

Visit this post for the LZ-305 aerial dreadnought tender. Only experienced Zeppelin builders need apply.

[Image: 2016-08-19_18_47_29.jpg]

Meanwhile Grand Alchemist Dahak contributes new APS Rebalance mechanics - try this if you feel the stock APS gunnery model makes battles too drawn out.

APS Adjustment Mod makes gunnery incredibly deadly with overpenetration, critical hits, ability to mount barrels inside the turret for historical barrel length, and many more features planned.

15 Aug 1905 - Our first Battle of Tsushima re-enactment, testing a part of the historical IJN 1905 order of battle! Pick up the Far East Operations blueprint pack here





14 Aug 1905: AFTER CATACLYSM / 1905 Rebalance Hotfix 2 Released

Victorian Sci Fi Airship Campaign Planning Commences!


13 Aug 1905: New staff positions available at Naval Technical Bureau "Novgorod" office and foreign service equivalents.

12 Aug 1905: We now have an official #1905navalreview channel on the FTD Discord Server!


Admiralty Update 9 Aug 1905.

AFTER CATACLYSM
mod tested, reviewed and rebalanced by members of 1905 Naval Technical Board. Download new AA guns, aesthetic parts with more on the way!




Anmeberry Accords presents, AFTER CATACLYSM v8 - 1905 Rebalance Edition

Download the mod package here! Includes upgraded AC refit Murakumo class destroyer by Cairo1, Borodino class 1:1 replica, and a Bf190E-4/B.

==========

After Action Report
FIRST BATTLE OF TIRAMISU STATION

Date: 8 Aug 1905 2200hrs - 0400 hrs (local time, Vladivostok Theatre of Operations)



Original music & Future Growth Support courtesy of

While main battle forces are engaged in the vicinity of Tsushima, the Japanese Navy dispatched a small task group led by an experimental battleship to raid offshore resource depots near Vladivostok, Russia.

Full details and Blueprints

==========

Admiralty Update 6 Aug 1905: 3rd Pacific Squadron (Oval) engaged in defensive fleet action against Japanese super-battleships of unknown class at a series of off-shore resource bases in the North Pacific theatre of operations.

Utilizing oval battleships as Arctic icebreakers, a squadron of advanced circular vessels reinforce Tiramisu Station, a mobile semi-submergible sea fortress system made possible by cutting-edge underwater construction technology developed and proven in the repair of Battleship Tsesarevich at Port Arthur, 1904.

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As the 2nd Pacific Squadron engages in the ill-fated Battle of Tsushima, two task forces of experimental Russian and Japanese warships led by flagships Catherine the Great and super pre-dreadnought Chiyuki battle over offshore resource bases in the vicinity of the Kuril Islands.

Player constructed units engage in an unpredecented scale against their opposing number; built for teamwork and comprising near-historical pre-dreadnought weaponry, torpedo boats, protected cruisers, armored cruisers and battleships of both historical and alternate-universe configuration battle over circular naval fortresses of a scale the world of 1905 has never seen.

Take command of individual units and build your own showcase scenarios by downloading ship blueprints from the most recent threads. Participate in future custom campaign building by contributing pre-dreadnought ships of your favorite nations to the project. Re-create historical warships like the Chinese Imperial Navy Hai Chi protected cruiser, or go mad with 16" howitzers with the Oval Siege Cruiser.

With over 40 community-designed ship blueprints received for testing from 15 July - 6 August, the "Round Ship Faction" has gotten BIG!

Admiralty Update: 2nd Elliptical Cruiser Division Order of Battle

Visit this thread for the present work list for Black Sea Headquarters in acceptance trials for new elliptical cruiser division! There are also square ships!

Admiralty Update: 1st Circular Squadron Deployment Exercise 18 July 2016

First tier round monitors, gunboats, torpedo boats and scouting airship approved.
View the list of ships and download blueprints here.

To submit ships, do view the approved weapons supplied on the blueprints linked above. They roughly correspond to historical pre-dreadnought era (1870-1905) weapons listed on http://www.navweaps.com

This tournament has taken on a new Victorian Fantasy theme! We're looking at Oval Armored Cruisers, steam-powered fighters and never-built prototypes from 1870 onwards. This serves as an ice-breaking activity before progressing to near-historical replicas.





*****

Admiralty Order No. 1 of 8 July 2016

BUILD ROUND SHIPS
Duration: 1-2 weeks or until completing order of battle.

All best in class submissions will be referred to the Admiralty for an official FtD faction proposal.

Every shipwright is expected to do his duty.
We enclose a list of requested designs forthwith:

Circular Saw Torpedo Boat Destroyer
Round Table Armored Cruiser
Total Ellipse Pre-Dreadnought (4x 12"/40 main armament covering all angles)
Full Moon Scout Airship
Not-A-Square-Meal Cargo Ship



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END

*****

The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
[Image: deQfeco.jpg]

Objective
This is a concept discussion thread. The object is to fine tune a possible hybrid PvP / PvE tournament based in the Pre-Dreadnought era with alternate universe Earth history.

Theater of Operations: North-Western Pacific Ocean / Yellow Sea / Sea of Japan
[Image: 64880-004-D86073A2.jpg]

Concerned with the growing conflict between Japan and Russia, the United States Navy has deployed the Pacific Fleet to Manila to safeguard US interests in the region. British and German naval forces are likewise on high alert, stationing some of their most modern warships at friendly Chinese ports.

Emphasis will be given for semi-accurate replicas of actual ship classes, with period weaponry. (Experimental, HMS Dreadnought-era "unlimited" class may be run separately depending on interest). Period weaponry, means, very few, or no weapons will be autoloading, which will generate more or less historical rates of fire, with low / greatly reduced chance of turret explosions. This should make battles very prolonged and epic.

References will be provided for period ships. I will help tweak incomplete or non-regulation ships to conform. Maybe add missing toilets.


Armor protection should be kept simple and functional. Most ships will require just 1 meter of metal armor protection. Many ships are styled very similarly to the point template "regulation" hulls can be given out to respective "nations" for outfitting. This was historical as for instance, the French and US were building ships for Russia. There will be a Russian bias! - Several Russian ships used tumblehome hulls which proved impenetrable but they will have historical weaknesses - top heavy and weak against Japanese HE / incendiary fire. They also had 1880s vintage rangefinders while the Japanese fleet had newer Barr & Stroud FA3s at the Battle of Tsushima, which could accurately track targets a full kilometer further than the 1880s Liuzhol.

Blueprints will be provided for select Navies - French, Russian, and German blueprints currently available from various sources.

PvP elements - classic team elimination style with possible collaboration between builders, gated by 'host nation' and ship class.

For instance, if 2 persons submit 2 Armored Cruisers that prove superior to that of a rival nation's design, both designs will enter the next round. This may give an element of unpredictability as one ship class may be weaker than the other, reducing the cruiser force's total capability!

Separate tournament 'threads' to be run by national teams & ship classes, for instance:

Japanese Navy, Pre-Dreadnought (Mikasa x2) vs Russian Imperial Navy (Borodino x1, Retvizan x1)
British Royal Navy, Torpedo Boat Destroyers (Various x5) vs United States Navy, Torpedo Boat Destroyers (Various x5)

Pre-Dreadnought era Doctrine evaluation
E.g. 5x Torpedo Boat Destroyers vs 1 Pre-Dreadnought - do torpedo boat doctrines work? If Yes, the battlegroup scenario will have more torpedo boat destroyers and less cruisers. If No, more Armored Cruisers will be deployed instead in the Decisive Battle.

List of ship classes:
Battleship (pre-dreadnought)
Armored Cruiser
Torpedo Boat Destroyer
A range of simple civilian or oddball ships for roleplaying and PvE purposes to be decided on - PvE commerce raider? Underway coal replenishment? Experimental submarine?

PvE Elements - as a concluding round once all ships are available for a national order of battle

Japanese 1905 Battlegroup (with torpedo boat destroyers, armored cruisers, battleships) vs Russian 1905 Battlegroup (likewise full order of battle).

Special PvE missions

Armored Cruiser task group scouting - approach enemy fleet and maintain contact for X minutes, report all contacts and disengage.

Commerce Raiding?
Shore bombardment?
Encounter with experimental submarine?

Special emphasis to Lamb the framerates and run the tournament anyway - it's my computer that's gonna burn not yours. Smile

Double special emphasis to award players for participation and collaborate / share approved hull templates and pre-made weapons. If you made a 12" or 6" turret for the French the same turret and gun is used for the Russians!

Final objective for all these beautiful ships - make a 1905 alternate history custom campaign with ridiculous attention to historical detail!

Thoughts? Comments? Hatemail? Leave them below.

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• Novgorod Naval Technical Board, 1905 Naval Review •
• Secretary to the Empress, Coronan Empire, Anmeberry Accord •
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2016-07-07, 06:01 AM (This post was last modified: 2016-07-07 06:01 AM by Stinger10034.)
Post: #2
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
This sounds like fun so ima build an armoured cruiser for youSmile
(Warning-might suck hard)
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2016-07-07, 06:34 AM
Post: #3
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
The text, my poor eyes, would it hurt to erm, make it a bit larger? please?

Click me for my BP Thread!
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2016-07-07, 06:51 AM (This post was last modified: 2016-07-07 06:52 AM by Chromoid.)
Post: #4
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
Dangerous Waters is running dry on design power again, isn't it? :^)

Anyways, this looks nifty! Not entirely sure how all of this will work after reading your post (although that could entirely be me staying up way past any sensible hour of the night), but if it isn't going to be too tremendously time-intensive, I could get behind it. Mind you, I wouldn't personally be able to participate as much as would probably be optimal, but I would love to see large pre-dreadnoughts smashing each other with concussive salvos!

(2016-07-07 06:34 AM)magma8520 Wrote:  The text, my poor eyes, would it hurt to erm, make it a bit larger? please?

ctrl + is your friend.

But yeah, that text is a bit on the small side, carmenara.

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2016-07-07, 07:44 AM
Post: #5
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
Firstly, this is a cool idea, and building realistic ships is fun, though i have a few questions.

Firstly: Is this only for replicas of real ships? Or can i build something that's clearly a ship of that era, but a completely original design? If we're doing an alternate history, i think anything reasonable should be fair game.

Secondly: How are CRAMs handled? I think they're better for long range gunnery (Slower shells with higher arcs making them behave like guns at far longer range), and in my mind, are about as powerful (by DPS) as an ACC 1/4th of the indicated size and half of the apparent size, though this is for ACCs firing faster.

Thirdly: One block of armor is not enough armor for anything! My normal AA guns can shoot through single block think metal beam walls with a single shell, and proper battleship guns generally are tested that they can pop or explode turrets on the Norge with a single shell. Doing this with only 12 inch shells may be slightly hard, but still doable. Also, metal blocks almost float. Given this, it's reasonable to assume that they're hallow, and in given by the fact they just barely sink, they cant be all that thick. Some back of the envelope math shows that a steel plate of one square meter and 5.1 inches thick would weigh the same amount as a cubic meter of water, given that in game metal blocks are heavier, lets round that up to 6 inches. Still, this is far less then the armor of some ships, with pre-dreadnoughts having more than double that in some places.

Fourthly: Where is the line between armored cruisers and battleships? In the real world, it was mostly speed and armor that this depended on, which are slightly nebulous in this game. Am i supposed to match the real speed? How do i do this? Spinblocked ion engines in the hull?

Fifthly: How do torpedoes work? Dumb torpedoes don't work on account of the AI cant hit crap with them, homing torpedoes don't really fit with this whole challenge, now do they?

Sixthly: Is PVP going to be AI vs AI, or actual multiplayer? Because this radically changes what i build, as the AI is dumb.
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2016-07-07, 03:16 PM (This post was last modified: 2016-07-07 03:33 PM by carmenara.)
Post: #6
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
Thanks for your input! I'll answer what I can (and change the font size) before going to bed.

(2016-07-07 07:44 AM)bs1110101 Wrote:  Firstly, this is a cool idea, and building realistic ships is fun, though i have a few questions.

Firstly: Is this only for replicas of real ships? Or can i build something that's clearly a ship of that era, but a completely original design? If we're doing an alternate history, i think anything reasonable should be fair game.

Nope I am not going to expect people to spend 3 weeks making perfect replicas of pre-dreadnoughts. We are going to move faster than that for productivity and common sense; Ship ordering and construction might be a bit more collaborative than usual tournaments. For instance I can whip up hulls very quick, and the weapon systems for this concept are going to be very simple.

We will be running low velocity APS only, and the 12" guns will use historical barrel lengths, which means length 2 APHE can actually bounce off a wall of relatively light armor. This makes battles very interesting and no possibility of one ship overwhelming each other right away unless one side commits to something silly (like the Russians charging into battle bow first at Tsushima).


Secondly: How are CRAMs handled? I think they're better for long range gunnery (Slower shells with higher arcs making them behave like guns at far longer range), and in my mind, are about as powerful (by DPS) as an ACC 1/4th of the indicated size and half of the apparent size, though this is for ACCs firing faster.

Probably not be using crams at all, they will be definitely OP against the simplicity and light construction involved in this 'campaign'. Remember pre-dreadnoughts really sucked - they were completely outclassed at every turn when used in WW1.

This 'feature' will come into play if we ever progress to HMS Dreadnought herself. We could have a USS Connecticut vs HMS Dreadnought showdown as those were the superships of the day, one a massive pre-dread with all sorts of different calibers, the other the first of the all big gun designs. Would be interesting to see which was the superior boat.


Thirdly: One block of armor is not enough armor for anything! My normal AA guns can shoot through single block think metal beam walls with a single shell, and proper battleship guns generally are tested that they can pop or explode turrets on the Norge with a single shell. Doing this with only 12 inch shells may be slightly hard, but still doable. Also, metal blocks almost float. Given this, it's reasonable to assume that they're hallow, and in given by the fact they just barely sink, they cant be all that thick. Some back of the envelope math shows that a steel plate of one square meter and 5.1 inches thick would weigh the same amount as a cubic meter of water, given that in game metal blocks are heavier, lets round that up to 6 inches. Still, this is far less then the armor of some ships, with pre-dreadnoughts having more than double that in some places.

Don't worry about this one - I have done testing using pre-existing replica ships. We won't be needing 7 meter thick armor plates. Keeping the protective scheme nearly historical means everything is basically 1-3 meters max at the armor belt. Details to be worked out when we actually order up some ships. I'm likely going to start off with torpedo boat destroyers first and concessions will be made for gameplay.

The ships can look like their real counterparts and if 1:1 doesn't work we'll try 1.5:1 to create our own fleet destroyers, but the armored cruisers and BBs are going to be 1:1. There will be certain themes and design trends ordered by each participating Navy. This will be quite easy to manage.

Japanese were using British doctrine and British designed ships. Russians were using French technology but some of their better ships like Potemkin, Retvizan and later Evastafi, were American designs.

This leaves the Germans and their excellent ships coming into their own unique niche and appearance. You can definitely design your own pre-dreadnoughts but until we unleash HMS Dreadnought, pre-dread armament rules will be in place - that means LOTS of secondary weapons and room will be given to create intermediate battery ships.


Fourthly: Where is the line between armored cruisers and battleships? In the real world, it was mostly speed and armor that this depended on, which are slightly nebulous in this game. Am i supposed to match the real speed? How do i do this? Spinblocked ion engines in the hull?

Interestingly there is some confusion regarding what is an armored cruiser and what is a battleship because some pre-dreadnoughts were so small they were called armored cruisers!

An interesting comparison is Potemkin vs USS St. Louis in the OP screenshot. The Armored Cruiser is larger and more advanced, being a 1906 design but lacks Potemkin's 12" main guns.


Many Armored Cruisers were used for transport duties and their lightened displacement and lack of primary armament means they will have much better seakeeping and maneuverability than the battleships.

Fifthly: How do torpedoes work? Dumb torpedoes don't work on account of the AI cant hit crap with them, homing torpedoes don't really fit with this whole challenge, now do they?

We'll figure it out but by keeping speeds at historical levels it will be possible to hit with torp spreads. Torps of that era were not exactly potent nor accurate so we won't have Long Lances spamming all over the map. I think it will be possible to score some lucky hits at short range with deep running torpedoes (very dangerous to deep draft battleships) on slow targets.

There are ways to fire a spread of dumb torpedoes Smile

Sixthly: Is PVP going to be AI vs AI, or actual multiplayer? Because this radically changes what i build, as the AI is dumb.

I plan to introduce some elements to get the ship owner to participate in the battle - Action reports, captain's logs, a bit of period roleplaying, maybe a little reading assignment at navweaps.com to familiarize with period technology and historical weapons; these might score some points with the Admiralty even if actual PvP is not plausible.

I do have some GMing experience but this will be the first time doing a period Navy themed event.




Ps.

Here's some "motivational" artwork from Japan Smile

[Image: Zhiwyuen+goes+down.jpg]

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• Secretary to the Empress, Coronan Empire, Anmeberry Accord •
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2016-07-07, 04:22 PM (This post was last modified: 2016-07-07 04:29 PM by The Immort4le.)
Post: #7
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
Hmm, I might try my hand at this style of building, though they're not likely to be historically accurate. Tongue

Note: The hull will be as close as I can get it, but other than that secondary armaments should be interesting.
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2016-07-07, 09:16 PM
Post: #8
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
I volunteer to decorate interiors and maybe some voice acting

I don't have time to build an entire ship but I may try my hand at building a civilian/oddball ship

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2016-07-08, 04:50 AM
Post: #9
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
This should be right up your alley - a round ship!

(2016-07-07 03:32 PM)StahlSentinel Wrote:  
(2016-07-07 01:50 PM)Njord Wrote:  
(2016-07-07 01:09 PM)StahlSentinel Wrote:  Just to clarify, the main reason that the increased weight for HA bothers me is that I was really hoping to have something to make ships out of so that they could survive bombardment without having to rely on cowardice active defenses or being so absurdly massive that they start looking out of proportion.
cowardice my ass, armour makes your ships slow. All modern ships use Active defenses due to the draw backs of caking metal on your hull...

And how can you argue with this sexy ship the US Navy is about to commission? And it doesnt even have a ramp!

That's all right and proper, being properly armoured should have a tradeoff in speed. Besides, unlike a large number of people, I went to the Onyx Watch school of building stuff instead of the Steel Striders or White Flayers ones. If you can't rely on your armour, what can you rely on to keep the guns firing?
Myself, I'm more of a pre-dreadnought/ironclad admirer - things from the era when armour was new and exciting, and unique designs like Admiral Popov's circular ironclad were being designed.

I mean, look at it:
[Image: 401a45980dd6b618e96f3b6204c6774a.jpg]
[Image: mX9RLBU6LVJk_vxTEKErVrg.jpg]
(Sure, it had some serious issues, but it's nowhere near as homogenous as the vast majority of modern ships, and FTD allows it to be what it could have been. Why be a slave to reality when you can make floating castles?)

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2016-07-08, 05:14 AM
Post: #10
RE: [Concept Planning] The Admiralty's 1905 Naval Review
By the way, what sort of shell types should we be considering here? I'm assuming things like HEAT and HESH are no-go since they didn't exist during the time period, but what about things like pen depth fuses and time fuses? Heck, what about frag warheads?

I know HE is more than likely fine though, just want to know if we're only going to be working with solid-only shells. That and what sort of barrel lengths are we working with anyway, was doing some experimentation with 12-inch (that's 305-ish mm in FtD terms) gun and shell designs. Tongue
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